The Devil Is In The Details


Up late, burning the midnight oil, and running math calculations on my smartphone while comparing the website character profiles to the in-game stat sheets.

Forum Post

Original Post:

2 hours ago
Blizzard Character Stat Sheet

My season 16 necromancer, GHUHAKHAHCAG, is a thorns build. The stat sheet shows 60, 568 Thorns Damage, but I should have much higher than that between legendaries, jewels, gems, cubed items, and skills. I wasn’t able to complete my LVL 30 solo Grift as a result of low thorns calculations. Been playing since launch day, you guys are doing a great job and god I know the math is hard. Keep up the good work! Love the thorns item designs that dropped, they’re just not amounting to their full potential.

helm: 2801 thorns, 709 vitality
shoulders: 8838 thorns, 562 vitality
necklace: +15% physical damage, 728 vitality
shirt: 7218 thorns, 482 vitality
gloves: 2838 thorns
bracers: 475 vitality
ring 1: 1988 thorns, 366 vitality, gem with 47200 thorns
ring 2: 2676 thorns, 473 vitality
belt: 7505 thorns, 484 vitality
pants: 2846 thorns, 783 vitality
weapon: 7522 thorns, gem with 14000 thorns damage
offhand: 2335 thorns, 605 vitality
skill: 200% multiplier for minions
cube items: 100% thorns applies on attack, chance to do %1000 thorns damage when hit, oculus ring (i’m pretty sure it buffs thorns, not sure, but if anything I’ll keep it for the revives and skellies and mages to do more damage when they’re not racking up thorns damage and crowd controlling)
set bonus: demon hide 6000 thorns damage
legendary shirt bonus: thorns equal to 251% of vitality (vitality is listed as 6290. i added up the +vitality on items and got 5,667 vitality, +290 from paragon, and whatever base level is at 70. the stat sheet in game shows 6580 vitality, so lets go with that, and say that 6580 – (5667+290) = 623 vitality base at level 70).
stats: 6616% damage increase from intelligence.

total thorns before percentage bonuses: 113, 768 (included 6000 fire thorns from set, +thorns damage, and gem and jewel) + 6580*2.51 = 113, 768 +16, 515.8 = 130, 283.8.

Minions should do 260, 567.6 thorns when hit.
Attacks with siphon blood should apply 130, 283.8 to ( 2327.6 weapon damage *3 from rune) + [1191 to 1467] + 30% to siphon blood from items +15% to physical skills +1.06x% per attack, where x is equal to the number of consecutive attacks, starting with 1 (also from minions? doesn’t look like it when I play…) +85% for standing in Oculus focus area, before getting multiplied by %6616 for the intelligence buff, giving siphon blood (137264.8 to 138732.7)*1.3333*1.15*(1.06x)*1.85*66.16 damage. Reduced, this is: 25,852,496.4*(1.06x) to 26,035,851.3*(1.06x) (That looks off…anyone care to check my math?)

Problems keeping thorns from being a viable build in a level 70 greater rift:
Thorns damage not taking into account stat bonus of +1% damage per stat point.
Hack legendary proc doesn’t transfer thorns damage on attack to minions.
Hack legendary proc doesn’t benefit from any +% bonuses on skills, and item bonuses to skills. +%damage bonus from weapon doesn’t apply to thorns.
+[x to y damage range] damage bonus from weapon and ring doesn’t apply to thorns.
+% physical damage on amulet and bracers doesn’t apply to thorns.
Thorns doesn’t crit and thorns doesn’t benefit from +critical chance and +critical damage.
Thorns doesn’t benefit from area damage% [except the likes of which are found on Sanguinary Vambraces].
Thorns doesn’t factor into +Life on Hit.

I NEVER see damage as high as 8 million on my combat number ticker. Highest I ever see is about 240k damage, which is the best possible result of enemies attacking my 200% thorns buffed minions (Aberrant Animator). With enemies having hp in the trillions in rifts i join, it would be nice to be able to contribute to the damage total with my thorns on attack. it would also be nice if the Hack axe bonus in my Kanai’s cube applied to all attacks, including those my minions make, along with the intelligence bonus, so my minions could do this higher amount of damage as well. As it stands, my damage is listed as 269, 363, so it doesn’t look like damage increased by Int (6,533%) is doing anything at all for me in relation to thorns.

I’m not sure how you guys add up the multipliers and percentages, in what order you do it, and if you add the percentages together or compound them, but if the thorns build is to have any viability in a solo 30 greater rift, as run with all these wonderful legendaries and sets I collected, I suggest you calculate the percentages as thorns*%*% and throw out thorns*(%+%) and steer clear from thorns(no % for you!). I have close to the best gear for my build without hacking, that I got from long hours of play, and I don’t think I will be able to find anything that will increase the damage of the build significantly beyond its current level, aside from upping my jewel in grifts. I suppose that this late in the season it doesn’t much matter, but I want to make sure I will have a viable build added to my non-ladder group when the season ends.

when i look at my character sheet in-game, it lists thorns as 132, 845, which differs slightly from what it shows on the website. If anything, this is the reportable bug (website values do not match in game values), and the damage numbers I told you about are the other reportable bug, if you take game balance impossibility as a bug!

That’s all for now! The rest is up to you!

Posting images here since forums don’t allow it:
Note: The items in this build have changed slightly (for the better) since posting this bug report. I am also seeing damage from siphon blood in the range of 50k per tick to 1.3 million per tick on critical.


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